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Rod Dole
By BRETT WILKISON
THE PRESS DEMOCRAT
Ninety-eight retirees in the Sonoma County pension system get more than $100,000 in annual pension payments, including three who receive more than $200,000, according to records released Wednesday by the retirement association.
The top pensioner is Rod Dole, the recently retired county auditor-controller-treasurer-tax collector. He gets $254,625 annually, or more than $21,000 per month. Dole’s 35 years with the county included 26 years as the chief financial officer.
Second is retired Sheriff Bill Cogbill, who receives $239,311, or nearly $20,000 per month. Cogbill served two terms in elected office and worked for the county for more than 32 years.
Other retirees in the top five are former county administrator Mike Chrystal, who receives $209,862 annually; former county clerk Eeve Lewis, $182,102; and former county public works director David Knight, $182,024.
The pension figures, which were made public for the first time as a result of a lawsuit filed by The Press Democrat, show what some say are the ballooning payments of a system that taxpayers are propping up at the expense of other public services.
“The public should be concerned. This level of benefits is unsustainable,” said Bob Andrews, the former owner of a benefits consulting firm who this year served on the city of Santa Rosa’s Pension Reform Task Force.
Stock market losses plus salary and benefit increases in the past decade have forced the county, like many other local and state governments, to pour millions more into its retirement fund to cover pension obligations. Unfunded obligations now total $249 million, according to actuarial reports prepared for the county retirement association.
The higher contributions by taxpayers include the county’s sale last year of about $290 million in bonds, a move that doubled the county’s pension debt.
The newly released records, while showing that the majority of county retirees earn pensions of $30,000 or less, are likely to add still more fuel to the fire.
“It’s no secret that we have to modify the way in which we look at our retirement system,” said Efren Carrillo, chairman of the county Board of Supervisors. He cautioned that the records were just a “snapshot” of the county’s retirement costs.
But he added: “I would agree that what we have now is not sustainable long-term.”
The board of the Sonoma County Employees’ Retirement Association reversed years of past practice by releasing the list of payments made to 3,916 retired county and special-district workers and their beneficiaries. The disclosure was ordered by a Sonoma County judge and upheld by a state appellate court after The Press Democrat sued last year for access to the records.
The data covers monthly pension payments through August.
It shows some of the top public retirees represented by SCERA make more in retirement than they did while working.
That list includes both Dole and Cogbill, whose 2010 county earnings, including salary, car and cash allowances, totalled $221,093 and $231,366, respectively. It also includes Chrystal, a 31-year county employee who retired in 2004 with a salary of about $180,000.
Dole, 59, and Cogbill, 58, did not return calls for comment Wednesday. Chrystal, 69, who along with Dole served on the county retirement board, declined to comment.
The records also show a wide disparity among what retirees earn. The top pension was more than 11 times the median annual pension, which is $22,552, and nearly nine times the average of $29,761.
About 64 percent of the retirees earn below the average pension, while about 36 percent earn more. The lowest annual payment was about $124 annually.
The records include county workers who have worked more than 30 years down to those who have worked five years, the minimum term to be eligible for retirement benefits.
The records appear to confirm a long-suspected trend: that career employees who’ve retired since benefit formulas were enhanced beginning seven years ago are helping fuel a rapid escalation in pension-system financial burdens. The average pension for retirees in 2009, according to SCERA, was $42,000, 69 percent more than the average for all retirees in the system.
Those at the top of county government are taking home the highest payments, receiving far more than their equally tenured predecessors. For example, Cogbill’s annual pension is nearly 70 percent larger than the pension earned by his predecessor, former Sheriff Jim Piccinini, who served five years in office and 27 years total with the county before retiring in 2003.
Of the top 10 county pensioners, all are elected or appointed department heads, with the exception of Linda Suvoy, the former assistant sheriff and Larry Scoufos, the former assistant district attorney.
The total payout to the 98 retirees who receive pensions of $100,000 or more is about $12.6 million. That means 2.5 percent of the retirees are collecting 10.8 percent of the county’s total annual pension payments of $116.5 million.
A more in-depth analysis was not immediately possible because the initial release of records did not include retirement dates, job titles, years of service or employer, information necessary to accurately evaluate trends in pension payouts. Courts in other jurisdictions have determined this to be public information and other county pension boards have released it.
“These were not items identified by the court to be withheld, and I will seek the court’s assistance to obtain this information if necessary,” said Tom Burke, attorney for The Press Democrat in the suit.
In a follow-up response late Wednesday, SCERA Administrator Gary Bei provided the dates of retirement for former employees. He referred the newspaper to decades of association monthly meeting agendas and minutes to determine employer information for each retiree.
Carol Bauer, leader of a group of former county workers who receive benefits from SCERA, blasted the disclosure of individual pension records Wednesday as a violation of privacy.
Publishing the pension figures “sets retirees up as a target,” said Bauer, president of the Sonoma County Association of Retired Employees.
She was also skeptical that it would help accurately frame or hasten any overhaul of the pension system.
“Pension reform is not going to be driven by putting those names in the newspaper,” she said. “Pension reform is going to be driven by negotiations with employee groups.”
Sonoma County’s retirement spending rose more than 250 percent over the past decade. Including additional payments on county pension debt, that 10-year rise is almost 340 percent.
By another measure, the contribution rate the county pays into its retirement system as a percentage of payroll tripled from 2000 to 2010, to 30 percent, or about $92 million including pension debt.
That means for every dollar the county pays toward salaries, it now pays an additional 30 cents into its retirement system and toward pension debt to support the current level of benefits.
Supervisors are set to return to the issue in early November. A report due then is expected to offer suggestions on ways to overhaul the retirement system and reduce county costs. Those proposals will feed into contract negotiations next year, a county spokesman said.
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What about those Voluntary Separation Incentives of up to $20,000 given to county employees to retire and save jobs of younger employees? Supervisor Carrillo hired back Gail Davis to the Agricultural Commissioner’s office in December 2010. She retained her pension of $71,000, kept the $20,000 payout incentive and now collects her full salary. How is this saving tax payers money? What other county employees have received this sweet deal?
What gets me, former landlord a retired So Co Sheriff officer, is a slum lord, decries lack of money. I was mortified at the astronomical amount he is receiving. We lacked a frig for a week, and replacement stove from some yard sale almost burnt the house down on the holidays. Them mold was causing walls to buckle and he cried no money to do repairs. When pension is $93,742.80 annual, and over 7000 grand per month. Makes me ill. That evil is greedy. The me first greed will wipeout or bankrupt us all. Pretty bad.
@LBR:
Public Safety of course.
You know, the ones that are each and every year gobbling up a bigger and bigger piece of the budget.
@GAJ – “So, yes, there is a direct correlation between approving ridiculous Union demands and the subsequent outrageous money grab by managers/supervisors.”
.
Most public employs have lost salary in the last 10 years when you adjust for inflation, so what “ridiculous Union demands” are you referring to!?
This is not how I want my money spent!
Government jobs being best.
Road blocks.
Neighbors turning each other in.
Stacked ‘n packed next to trains.
Heavy taxation.
Oppressive governance.
Reminds me of a different country,
in another time.
Wish it was a movie.
Public employee…
and union.
An oxymoron.
The Press Democrat had to file a law suit to get this info?
“Pension reform is not going to be driven by putting those names in the newspaper,” she said. “Pension reform is going to be driven by negotiations with employee groups.”?
This is the problem right here… these people actually think they are running a family business.
You work for the TAX PAYERS! You don’t make the rules, we do!!
Fire them all and start over. There would be dozens of people willing to do the same job at reduced benefits.
How dare they hold a gun to our head when collecting property tax and think they’ll tell us how pension reform will be addressed.
Stuff like this can change this bleeding heart liberal into a NeoCon.
My husband worked for the county over 20 plus years. He got hurt on the job and had to take disability retirement. He receive’s $1,155.00 a month after $800.00 is taken out for medical. This sucks….Dole makes $21,000.00 a month that’s more than my husband makes in a year…..something is very very wrong…..HELP!!
http://www.watchsonomacounty.com/sonoma-county-pension-payments/?appSession=440239745280650
Or present Judge Marcoida 82k per year, and a Judges salary of how much 200k plus, is this the same person I have no idea.
http://www.watchsonomacounty.com/2011/09/county/new-pension-data-shows-98-county-retirees-receive-more-than-100k-annually/
Sondra Schopflin whose husband may have been Tom the CAO who shot himself off duty and this is what is wrong with the County feathering the managers nests.
$6500 per month 78k per year.
I would HIGHLY ENCOURAGE the PRESS DEMOCRAT to personally phone Jo Weber Direct of HUMAN SERVICES at the COUNTY OF SONOMA………..hey it is in the phone book under government pages, see powder blue section front of phone book.
I CHALLENGE you (THE GREAT PRESS DEMOCRAT)…… to spend an hour at FOOD STAMP OFFICE, Family Youth & Children, Valley of Moon Foster Care Center, the Youth JAIL, the COUNTY JAIL, Adult & Aging (In home support people), Welfare etc. …. the County has plenty of sweat shop; just chose some.
Come sit the trenches of hell with the RANK & FILE employees and mail room; so you can REPORT THE TRUE STORY of what the ONLY REAL COUNTY EMPLOYEES ARE DOING……..working ourselves to death.
Maybe the county should start making a grave yard in that huge empty lot on Mendocino & Paulin drive.
Heck the public can come bury us…..and let them have these jobs since THE PUBLIC thinks we have “HEAVEN MADE JOBS”
……….but NO you report how great the TOP IS…….not only public paying for this…so I am out of my paycheck for 10 years now, including other clerical people paying for management & department heads that set this up and IMMEDIATELY RETIRE.
NOW THERE IS A REAL….STORY FOR YOU.
I CHALLENGE YOU PRESS DEMOCRAT TO REPORT THIS STORY………..
DEPARTMENT HEADS…….BOARD OF SUPERVISORS…….DIVISION HEADS all made sure to get this program and percentage clicks in……..so they would benefit. tHEN THIS SUPER RICH LEFT….OFFICE with everyone else to pay their tab including THE CURRENT COUNTY EMPLOYEES FOR 10 YEARS NOW…..
All of us little employees (mail room – file clerks – clerical workers) are the TRUE ONES paying hundreds out of OUR PAYCHECKS TO help people like Rod Dole……and Bob DEIS….
also PRESS DEMOCRAT INTERESTING YOU DID NOT MENTION……..
WHAT MR. BOB DEIS IS MAKING IN HIS RETIREMENT……BOARD OF SUPES BASICALLY FIRED HIS BEHIND……..
WHAT ABOUT BOB DEIS
@Stephen:
What you don’t quite get is that in the private sector, managers approving ever increasing pay increases will eventually face budget constraints and be forced to change them or be fired, especially when times get tough.
In the public sector the more a manager approves ever increasing pay and benefit increases the more they can justify increases to their own, because, after all, a “spread” must be maintained between the rank and file and managers. In effect by granting increases at the lower levels it raises their own boat right along with it and while there is a slim chance they might be fired, there is no chance that their benefits can be changed retroactively as that is illegal!
In the private sector when the “customers” stop buying, and the money flow slows, all heck breaks loose and drastic changes are made.
In the public sector when the money flow slows you can simply increase fees/taxes to help make up the difference and if that doesn’t work, start cutting services. The LAST place to cut would be at the top.
So, yes, there is a direct correlation between approving ridiculous Union demands and the subsequent outrageous money grab by managers/supervisors.
@Reality Check – In college I remember references like yours being used in examples of “runaway” or “snowball building” statements. Basically, no real backing to them, just outbursts of truly unsupported rants.
“American (industries) have been brought down by union greed and feckless management”.
Ok, so lets level the playing field and compete with other manufacturing countries/regions. What countries shall we use? China, Mexico, Haiti, Thailand? Tell me, why aren’t you living there then since there are no unions to “corrupt” things? Would you survive milking rubber from a tree for $.10/hr? Who would you be blaming then for your situation? I bet you will find NO middle-class there. There is private industry creating the EXTREMELY rich and using the EXTREMELY poor to create the goods and make the rich richer. I agree that unions are not always doing the “best” for the good, but on the big picture they have helped keep and maintain a middle class America.
Sure, I agree there needs to be some pension overhaul for the spiking formula. Do these people on the list deserve what they are getting then? Maybe. Did you compete, or were you qualified for their job? I am sure some of them have the resume of some very qualified CEO’s.
And for all the “we the taxpayers are funding this”, I bet if you did some research you’d be surprised on how much of our “taxes” are used to “assist” (bailout) the private sector. From the PD a while back:
“Remember when teachers, public employees, planned parenthood, National Public Radio and the Public Broadcasting Service crashed the stock market, wiped out half of our 401(k)s, took trillions in taxpayer-funded bailouts, spilled oil in the Gulf of Mexico, gave themselves billions in bonuses and paid no taxes? Yeah, me neither.”
Although it is true that these high pensions are being paid to non union emplyees, the union pay scale adjustments and perks are really what drives up management salaries and benefits.
For example, the Chief of Police for Santa Rosa who is non union was just awarded a raise in compensation “due to parity” with those below his rank…all of which are unionized employees.
Public employees should not be allowed to unionize. Pay should be based on merit and market driven factors…just like every other business.
The arrogance of the public pension systems was clearly demonstrated by their refusal to open their books for public inspection without a court fight.
Thats your government. Arrogant.
Notice in the news that Governor Jerry Brown wants to GUARANTEE a funding level for police departments despite the recent release of the FBI Annual Crime Report that shows serious crime falling EACH year for the last five years?
And, we all know that police do nothing but file reports after the fact on small crimes such as petty theft, etc.
Yet Governor Brown is seeking to placate the police unions with more of OUR money.
These are MANAGERS and Adminstrators and Department Heads and Chiefs. NOT rank and file line union workers. Unions have been the only people fighting AGAINST excessive management salaries,so your attacks on them are misplaced. It’s really sad to see the lack of basic logic, reasoning and reading comprehension on these boards.You keep blaming unions for managers and administrator’s high salaries, when the unions are those fighting against excessive manangement pay. I know the poor journalism at the Press Democrat doesn’t help to make this clear, but come on read the article: These are ALL Department Heads and Chief Administrators. They DO NOT BELONG to employee unions and unions do not bargain for them. So Get Off Your Fox News Talking Points and stop bashing unions and start bashing management. They are the problem, not the unions.
Lots of union people on here crying foul! You just don’t get it. It just doesn’t matter. It’s unsustainable. It won’t be there for you or management. That is what unsustainable means.
If they expect the taxpayer to step up and poor more of our hard earn money (taxes) into this debacle…
No thank you, I have my own IRA to deal with!
If you believe that union and government employees earn less than private sector employees, don’t read this: (from Friday, Sept. 23, 2011)
http://www.cnn.com/2011/09/23/politics/truth-squad-santorum-unions/index.html
Readers have this all wrong. The people receiving these pensions did not authorize them. The County Board of Supidvisors did. They are the ones who should be held accountable for making county employees rich on pensions.
The Supidvisors put the ordinances, regulations and policies in place that made of this possible. And they did it with their eyes wide open.
The real scandal is how the Board is in the back pocket of the unions and the unions drive the county pay and benefit structure. The county Human Resources department recommends pay increases or the employee management associations recommend wage and pension benefits and the county rubber stamps them. It has been going on for years.
It is a closed system. County wages are compared with other county wages and benefits and salaries are driven up and up with no regard to what is happening in the private sector to wages and pensions.
This whole scheme has got to be stopped and a new method of determining salaries and pensions setup. Government cannot be immune to what is happening in the private sector.
The Board needs to be held accountable for its decisions in these matters. The managers just took advantage of their decisions.
The real criminals are drawing outrageous pensions and the cops are locking up the medically mismanaged.
What else is new?
Call me naive, but I see names on this list for people I have seen recently working at the County Center. Wouldn’t this be called double dipping??
We need full disclosure of ALL RELATIVES hired by family members, phoney jobs and all, the insiders KNOW the score, the public is funding useless management positions. SCWA is at the forefront.
@Countyworker
Thanks for the info. I believe all of it except for EC.
This guy is the biggest scammer and manipulator in the recent history of County government. If he’s only getting $1500/month I smell a dead rat.
The figures for Cale, Reilly, Smith and Zane are more representative.
Maybe we should start a charity fund for the rest? Helen Rudee was the best Supervisor in the last 30 years. I hate to think what she’d getting compared to this crew.
There is a problem here, but it doesn’t involve the frontline workers.
There are a lot of quirks in the County retirement system. Guess you know what they are and how they can further distort facts.
And I can’t believe the TAX Collector brings home that money in retirement. It’s time to storm the buildings!
These guys are lucky it isn’t 1776. They’d be run out of town ahead of a tar and feathering…
Pity progress.
Unreal! This is why so many people want to be cops, and firemen, and part of the Sherrif department… it’s a total scam!
Public employees shouldn’t be allowed to unionize. If you don’t like that don’t take the job. There are hundreds of people that will be willing to replace you.
As for these managers… who the hell signed off on Cogbill getting $240,000 a year, after retirement, AFTER getting paid more than a similar private sector job?!?!
The answer is to simply say no. We’re not paying you. End of the gravy train.
The way most get more in a pension than they did working if by cashing in a pile of absurd vacation accumulation in their last year. This is how former Chief of Police Fong in San Francisco weaseled a pension that is 42% higher than any year she ever “worked”. She’ll earn more in retirement than her total earned while working. It is simple gaming of the system.
Once again, the problem lies in those in charge of agreeing to this fiasco. Those on the City/County side “negotiating” these pensions are part of the pension themselves. It is a complete conflict of interest, but who cares, it is only taxpayer money. And we all know there is an endless supply of it.
As for contributions by the employee…refer to my other posts. The level of required contribution is nowhere near enough to generate a guaranteed pension for life. That is simple mathematics. Those who contribute in a 401k (private sector) face market risk. Pension contributions don’t. Add in the 6.2% social security tax that isn’t paid by the government worker and the ending take home pay for a government employee is significantly more than the private sector. Though you’ll never see a “study” that actually mentions that.
These county pensioners are worse than Bernie Madoff. They’re stealing from the public trust. Where’s the federal investigation. The city of Bell had one. What’s wrong with us! Oh, I forgot; we don’t prosecute crimes like this, just like those bank guys who got away with it too. The people should be outraged. Too bad, most of them are sleeping.
What does the number people drawing low monthly pensions tell us? Nothing . . . unless we compare the pension with the time worked to earn it.
The pension formula tells all. Is it 2%, 2.5%, or 3% and at what age and for how many years worked. As far as I can tell, the general plan for county employees is 3% per year at age 60. For public safety employees it’s age 50.
Thus, getting a pension over 100% of final salary is not difficult. A general employee who starts work at 25 will become eligible at age 60 for a pension of 105%.
I just want to remind everyone that county employees pay into their retirement! It is not only funded by taxpayers dollars. In fact it is mandatory that we pay into the system and is quite a bit of money for a single Mom working her butt off.
The answer is obvious since it is what the private sector adopted decades ago: Defined contributions system, not defined benefits. In other words, the government that employes an individual pays an agreed amount into a pension plan for that employee, and those contributions stop when employment stops. What the employee gets out is dependent on how the money is managed, but not an ongoing unlimited liability to the former employer – ie taxpayers.
This is the sensible way forward and you should only vote for people signed up to support this approach going forward. Make every candidate state their position and hold them accountable to implement it when in office.
@Jim – so would you also get rid of military pensions, which they qualify for after 20 years, along with health? What about for teachers? So after a public employee retires, what are they supposed to live on!? Most public employees in the state do not pay into social security, and so do not qualify for that. Would you put them out on the street? The County is different, but employees pay A LOT towards retirement between SS and the County retirement.
The real problem is the system…”county’s total annual pension payments of $116.5 million”
Stop for a minute and think about that. $116.5 million dollars per year (and growing exponentially) is being paid to people WHO DON’T WORK FOR THE COUNTY ANYMORE.
I have no problem with pensions in the private sector. If a private company wants to pay their employees a pension, so be it. We saw it with GM, the airlines, etc. As an investor I avoid investing in companies that have pensions because eventually the weight of the pension liability always leads to bankruptcy.
In the public sector, where politicians think that they can spend endlessly and keep going back to the well (the taxpayer well) and extract more money, that’s where I have a problem. There is no logical reason why the government should create an endless pool of dependents when it is taxpayer money funding them. There is no reason why the county (or any city and state) should have $166M annual expense with no benefit. The county, i.e. the people of Sonoma County, should not pay $116M+/year to pay for people who used to work for them. It is ridiculous.
For those who think county management is union, THEY ARE are NOT, so DON’T BLAME THE UNIONS. The unions are just as unhappy at the pension AND THE perks these managers get when working. Huge amounts of county paid deferred compensation isn’t even factored into the above amounts. Rank and file county workers can’t pad their pensions. Most of them can’t get overtime. Most of them don’t get deferred compensation unless they put into it out of their pay checks (no county paid).
So that pension is really only a small part of what managers get.
There is a tool at the end of the article that you can use to look up pensions by name, or to get a list of those making above a certain amount, or you can just sort all 4,086 records. I sorted smallest to largest, and there were some records missing at the bottom it seems, but anyway, here is what I got, listed as cumulative totals:
.
People – monthly pension
1150 – < $1,000
2300 – < $2,000
3000 – < $3,000
3400 – < $4,000
.
So, 28% (1150 . 4086) make less than $12,000 annually. 56% (2300 / 4086) make less than $24,000 annually. 83% make less than $48,000 annually.
.
83% is probably close to the number of non-management employees at the County, you know, the ones covered by unions…
Blame 911 and the Taliban.
After 911, people voted to give the Public safety employees a blank check, and they cashed it in full. Of course management was not going to let that gravy train leave without them!
Now we need to make radical change to undo the damage – declare bankruptcy and negate these strangling commitments, otherwise see government services crumble.
Oh, but watch out, the political bosses are trying hard to pass a new law that these contracts cannot be eliminated in bankruptcy – don’t let then take away our only card left to play!
There is a distinction between manager and line employee in terms of benefits, but the biggest difference is between mid-management and top-management. It is only top management and the BOS that get to manipulate the system to spike their retirement.
Guess what Bob Dole is doing now?
He’s in bed with the local trash hauler and a bankrupt developer (Dennis Hunter and Alan Strachan) in a deal to make huge profits off of the PACE program that he pushed so hard for.
What’s PACE, you ask?
It’s that ridiculous farce where you get a second mortgage to pay for solar panels and the loan gets paid off on your property taxes. But they don’t call it a loan. Oh no. That would be too real.
They call it an ASSESSMENT. So Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac said NO WAY we’re going to lend on a first mortgage and then be in second position behind this property-tax-secured loan.
Do you get it?
Bob Dole was lobbying for a program that he now benefits from. And HUGELY. Strachan and Hunter predict that there is about $5 Trillion in loan money out there.
TRAVESTY.
CRIMINAL.
OUTRAGEOUS.
Let’s see some reporting on that, PD.
Take a look at YGRENE. Dole/Strachan/Hunter’s new company.
FAT.
Hello, Grand Jury. The people have been robbed.
What this shows is the arrogance of our elected officials. You basically have these people enriching themselves at the benefit of others. And what work do they really do? Nothing. And don’t tell me it is hard being an elected official because it isn’t.
What we need to do is abolish retirement and health benefits for elected officials and make the positions part time. That way you won’t have them running for office soley for financial gain like they do now. Remember you run for office to serve your community, not to set yourself up for life.
Maybe it is time for a ballot measure in Sonoma County to get rid of retirement and health insurance for the Supervisors and cut the pay in half. Even if something like that these same supervisors would do everything they could to stay in office because they don’t know how to get a real job in the private sector that actually produces something.
I understand the sense of outrage at Dole’s pension, but I don’t understand the expectation that he meet with the media to justify it.
He didn’t determine the payout formula; he just accepted it. This isn’t Dole’s doing. It’s the doing of those the people of Sonoma County elected.
Let’s place responsibility where it belongs. If we want to change the system, then we need to elect people who will change it.
@John T
Great point about having a balanced perspective towards this issue.
Maybe Mr. Dole could agree to an interview with a local media outlet. It doesn’t have to be with the PD. It would be interesting to hear a justification for such a generous retirement package.
Let’s start at the very top, with the Board of Supervisors, shall we?
Mike Kerns at over $4400 per month…. on top of his 30 year, or close to it, public safety CALPERS pension at the rate of a top step police sergeant from the City of Petaluma.
Tim Smith… $12K per month? Really? No wonder a young man like Efren Carillo wanted to devote himself to public service as an elected member of the board.
Clearly the BoS has voted themselves the most lucrative deal of all. And stood idly by while other elected officials, with Mr. Dole as suspect in chief, have worked themselves deals that far exceed the amount they ever contributed.
Time for a complete housecleaning of the board at SCERA and the removal from voting status on the board of county officials who would stand to gain from decisions made.
@Steveguy
Sorry to say but the “rank and file” county workers do not have access to retirees data anymore than you do. So there is no whistle to blow. The PD took the first step in forcing the county to release this data. If they would publish the whole list, that would be a great secon step!
@Pearl Alquileres and all the rest blaming the unions for this:
The top dog retirees would be the same people/amounts if the union were not in existance. Most, if not all, of the retirees making disgusting amounts of money from the county’s retirement system are/were management. I am not defending the union. I am just stating facts.
@Mirror Mirror,
I’m sure you are correct in your portrayal of the relationship between employees and commercial airlines.
However, I was referring to the manufacturers of airplanes, specifically Boeing.
In the latter case, unions have behaved badly and damaged the company, and now the Federal government has entered the fight and will do further damage.
The information released would be more useful if it included the total amount Dole contributed from his earnings to the pension fund, as well as the interest on that contribution.
I believe that the 3%@60 retirement required employees to pay 12% into their retirement. For Dole’s salary, that means he paid over $20,000 per year into his retirement.
It’s still a great deal. But regardless of how much your company puts in, how many of the private sector folks put 12% away each year for retirement?
Once again the PD fails when it comes to competent journalism. Is it too much work for you to pull out a calculator and at least estimate what Dole contributed over his 30+ year career? God forbid the PD attempt to write a balanced article.
To the Press Democrat: How many retired County employees have annual pensions of $25,000 or less?
Reality check wrote:
…”And, sadly, today we are seeing our once dominant commercial airline industry decline to 2d-class status.”
It is incorrect to conclude that the unions have caused the decline of commercial airlines.
My husband has worked for a major airline for over twenty years, and I am a former airline employee. He has not had a raise in about ten years and has taken a pay cut, as have all the rank and file employees.
Every contract negotiation is like pulling teeth.
Commercial airlines are private companies, not government owned, so the union representatives are negotiating with management for the pay, benefits and working conditions of their employee groups. Taxpayers are not required to pay taxes to fund salaries or pensions of airline employees-a very different scenario than public employee unions.
The similarities are that management is highly paid and have extremely generous bonuses and pension packages, even when the other employee groups are understaffed and see their salaries and benefits cut, no matter their skill set or training level.
@ Bear
Monthly First Last
Pension Name Name
419.12 ROBERT THEILLER
2,154.27 JAMES HARBERSON
1,520.02 ERNEST CARPENTER
3,118.00 MICHAEL CALE
4,461.87 MICHAEL KERNS
2,025.86 NICK ESPOSTI
7,786.45 MICHAEL REILLY
12,015.12 TIMOTHY SMITH
Job Title Employee Name Adopted Salary Adopted Benefits Adopted Total Year
SUPERVISOR SMITH, TIMOTHY P $71,561 $23,240 $94,801 2000-2001
SUPERVISOR ZANE, SHIRLEE R
$165,585 $77,865 $243,450 2011-2012
Looking back on PD articles about retirements this year, where is former County Council Steve Woodside’s retirement number?
Relax everybody. Everyone who gets paid sum X after 30 years of work paid in proportionately.
Ok, Rank and File… Stand up and whistle blow then, other wise you go down with them, as the system is totally unsustainable.
What part of unsustainable do you not understand ?
The only next step is total collapse.
Take your choice Rank and File. None, or a reasonable system.
Reasonable doesn’t work, so you are NOT going to get your ‘retirement’ , nor your health care for life as the top tier has stolen the money. Same as in the private sector, welcome to the REAL world, and bow down to you masters that are taking your retirement away by their own greed.
You just watch. Whistle blowers unite and be heard ! otherwise, go down with the sinking ship and lose it all, and have a revolt of the citizenry on your hands.
Sorry to spout truth, but unsustainable is just that.
My pitchfork and torch business looks better and better.
If only I could figure the carbon taxes for the torches. That is a 3 year environmental and Air Quality Board Review. Dang, can’t even do what Thomas Jefferson said anymore.
I will use paraffin. When do we revolt ?
Ban all Public Employee Unions NOW!
Cut the greed heads by 50%. Do it now.
Looks like the same ideas voiced in this “rant” could be used against the current government. Obama is making sure he lines the pockets of the undeserving at the cost of the tax payer. Yet all the good liberals making comments here are more than happy about giving tax dollars to support those welfare bums. But let a person WORK for 35 years and retire…whoa..can’t let them make the money they deserve. LOOK AT WHAT CEO’S RETIREMENT! THESE PEOPLE ARE IN THE SAME JOB CLASS!
“Greed is good”
Good old Gordon Gecko would make more working for the government than playing the stock-market nowadays.
Who are the real thieves in this country?
You are right Steven, these six figure salaries (with perks) belong to management and I am sick to death of those on the top getting away with murder while those of us on the bottom (UNION OR NON UNION) get screwed. I hope these anti -union posters understand that management NOT UNIONS are the excessive salaried. And this goes for private or public corporations. These guys wreck the economy and give themselves bonuses while the tea partiers are yelling “blame the teachers!” “blame the unions!” Hell the only way a working man could even hope to get decent wages from these greedy bosses is with a union! Let’s hear you complain about managers and administrators dittoheads!
“Ah the blood of tyrants and rebels make good fertilizer for a democracy” A quarter of a million dollars to pay someone not to work, and exponential raises for the position for the new higher. The power to tax is just intoxicating.
$250,000.00 + a year while in retirement….leaving Sonoma County with the highest per capita debt out of all 58 counties in California….
Well at least the pension obligation bonds that your so famous for will in your words, “save us money”.
Now that SCERA followed a court order to release this data, I kindly ask others to take a look at the County’s financial statements. When more and more tax payer money starts leaving the general fund to cover the underfunded pensions in the retirement fund, remember how much money we saved by taking on enormous debt.
These are MANAGERS and Adminstrators and Department Heads and Chiefs. Not rank and file line staff. So stop bashing unions and start bashing management. They are the problem, not the unions.
Where were all of the complaints when private sector employees were making money hand-over-fist during the tech boom and driving housing costs through the roof so none of the average, “public servants” (yes, teachers, police, fire, and county employees)could afford to live and work in the same city? And where was the outrage when house-flippers borrowed and spent money they didn’t have and put us all in this economic pickle? There is no single villain. Yes, some of these pensions appear outrageous and some changes need to be made so it is sustainable–it is in everyone’s interest. But turning on each other and oversimplifying the issue won’t solve anything. And the PD is just fanning the flames to get a headline and sell papers and advertising space. There’s no real analysis here–just hype.
The attempt to separate union and management responsibility here is weak.
First, management is not going to be offered a pension formula less than that of subordinate employees. Period. So, if the janitor gets 3% per year, then Dole is going to get 3% per year. Which, at 35 years, means a pension of 105% of final base salary.
Add in various spiking options, which of course everyone opposes (not!), and we hit 115%.
Still, this isn’t the fault of unions. They seem to have a single purpose: get the best contract possible for members. If we elect people who willingly agree to outrageous pension demands, well, who’s the responsible party?
Unfortunately, combined unions and weak management will kill the goose. Just look at America’s once dominant steel, auto, and rubber industries, brought down by union greed and feckless management. And, sadly, today we are seeing our once dominant commercial airline industry decline to 2d-class status.
Mr. Dole was a member of the Retirement Board for many years (as is Mr. Chrystal), so helped craft the policies that led to his rich pension. Mr. Dole as Auditor Controller Treasurer Tax Collector recommended the Board of Supervisors issue Pension Obligations Bonds to support his rich pension. Finally, Mr. Dole bullied his way to a 13% increase in pay in his last year of work to spike his rich pension. And this is just the tip of the iceberg when you talk about what is wrong with the county’s pension system.
I know all these people. My problem is the difference between managers and frontlne employees. Mangers do NOT do the work.
Senior technical people do the work and have to fight to get good ideas past management. Because management serves “at the will” of the BOS. So if the BOS wants to edit your staff report, management does it for them.
And get these rewards.
As do the retired memebers of the BOS.
I want to know what Ernie Carpenter gets.
Can anyone here help me out?
Please note the difference between what managers get and what line employees get.
Then give me the retirement benefits of all former Supervisors and I will explain it for you.
This bear is outraged.
@Jim
Management isn’t part of the unionized workforce, Unions don’t own the rights to the word pension.
Unions have long been against pension spiking, management along with police and fire associations on the other hand use it as common practice. Sonoma County has a huge management pension spiking problem, the unions are against them doing so. In Rod Dole’s case he is getting 250K annually for the rest of his life, that equates to at least 5 blue collar jobs, you really think unions want that money to go to Dole?
Management has never had accountability in Sonoma County, they deprive those below them in order to give it to themselves later.
UNION YES.
Jim, maybe you don’t know this but management ARE NOT UNION. The unions are no happier about this than you are. Afterall, the more managers get the less the frontline employees get and the more sacrifices they have to make including layoffs to support so many managers who are all still at their jobs despite layoffs. SO DON’T BLAME THE UNIONS FOR WHAT THESE TOP DOGS GET. Afterall, the managers make the budgeting rules and protect themselves from layoffs.
In fact, the unions are working to stop the deferred compensation the county is paying on currently employed managers. It is a shocking amount. Over the years, as raises were given as a percentage of income the spread in income has widened between frontline workers and management. Not only that, but as frontline workers have been laid off the ratio of frontline workers to management has narrowed. The county IS JUST TOO TOP HEAVY and the BOS are unwilling to do anything about it. Since 2006 the county has ADDED managers while laying off frontline workers WITH THE APPROVAL of the BOS
Thouroughly disgusted! NO ONE should be making that kind of money off of pension funds, that can’t promise to pay out future pensions….I am a county employee and make $23,000.00 net pay annually. I can barely pay my rent & bills, no wonder Rod Dole has that huge silly grin on his face!
Thank goodness we finally have shed a light on the darkness that is the creation of most of our debt problems. And now those responsible for these outrageous benefit packages are scurrying like cockroaches for cover.
Better yet maybe those who so carelessly throw their votes in the basket will begin to pay attention to the policies and ideologies their votes support.
Wonder what the average is for those retiring since 2000, after the huge grandfathered in Pension giveaways to Public Safety started?
THAT would be interesting.
The numbers presented here show that prior to that Pensions appear to have been reasonable and sustainable…not good enough for the “Greediest Generation” however.
Baby Boomers in positions of power/authority have no shame.
Condolences to future generations who will have to pay for their greed.
Sweet
This is criminal.
This is unsustainable.
These people are thieves along with the unions and the politicians that received money to make this happen.
The system does need to be changed. Payment for life at such huge amounts. I know there are other factors such as employees pay into the system too, but earning more than you previous made is just too much
But Press Demo, don’t pretend that SCERA just so happended to release the information. You sued them to. The judge said they had to release this info but not contact info, retirement date, etc. So, don’t play dumb of trying to find SCERA reason for not releaseing personal information.
“It shows some of the top public retirees represented by SCERA make more in retirement than they did while working”
HOW CAN ANYONE SUPPORT SUCH A SYSTEM???
If this were a CEO being paid more for not working for a private company the media would be all over it. Yet there is no outrage that the taxpayer is on the hook to pay someone for NOT WORKING more than when they were working.
No mention of the fact that we taxpayers are paying the person currently in the position these thieves retired out of. Hmmm, why was that overlooked??
Makes perfect sense to pay the RETIRED “county auditor-controller-treasurer-tax collector” more than $21,000/month for life. Sure. Who could argue with that? No one. No question he is worth more NOT working than working, given none of those titles listed does any good for the county anyway.
“That means for every dollar the county pays toward salaries, it now pays about 30 cents into its retirement system and toward pension debt to support the current level of benefits”
COMPLETE unsustainable. Yet we can’t eliminate pensions because the unions bribe the politicians and the Sheeple voters are easily manipulated.
So 11% of the budget goes to 98 retirees? WHERE IS THE UPROAR? Seems people love to get upset that “wealth” is “controlled” by too few people (classic Obama rhetoric) but here, 10% of the budget goes to less than 100 people??
ABSURD!
The reason there is no uproar is because the unions control the politicians in CA. If this were a corporation, we’d have every politician screaming about how overpaid upper management is and how the people at the bottom are being taken advantage of.